johnny330i Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) I have seen very few threads on this site about improving the handling abilities of our E46's, I wondered why this is? Is it because the Msport variants (which a lot of cars on here are) do a pretty good job on their own? Or is it because owners of such cars arent that interested? Either way, I'd like a little less wallowing, and a bit more predictability from my BMW, I'd also like to cure some of that chronic understeer and body roll! What sort of mods would people suggest to improve the handling of my SE (i know - buy an msport really isnt an option for me atm). And I have come up with the following options: -msport shocks w/eibach springs -JOM coilovers (don't want to affect the ride comfort beyond msport stiffness though -Thicker ARB's (perhaps msport ones were uprated, I don't know) -Decent rubber on my 17's - I think any bigger wheel would have a negative effect on handling -Polybushing lower arms and rear subframe The e46 (afaik) already has very good weight distribution and seems to have a good stiff chassis, there's no reaon in my eyes that the e46 couldn't handle very well. Opinions? Also, is there ANY way to turn off traction control in a E46 that's equipped with ASC? Edited December 6, 2011 by Johnny320d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielJames Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 I'd go with the JOMs. For the money they are well rated on E46Fanatics and on here, plenty of the VAG boys run them too. Sourcing good Sport Shocks and the Eibach springs will be expensive! Joms can be had for £220! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny330i Posted December 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Well there has a set of msport kit went for £90 on the bay, rarely go that cheap. Anyone got info about ride uality on JOM's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 One of the biggest changes changes to a more neutral balanced chassis you will see is not running a staggered offset on your tyres, putting 225's all round will transform a badly under steering car and also improve the steering response, uprated bars are a must even if you do get some stuffer shocks and springs if you really want to eliminate body roll, even my old 320d sat on kw v3's on max stuff still had a surprising amount of roll when you really pushed on. Interestingly my sport handles completely different to my SE, surprising in as much that the sport running on 225's all round is neutral at best whilst my SE on staggered 225/255's is an oversteer monkey, in fact it was almost dangerous on 225's all round, what I'm saying in a round about way is geometry, make sure it's c**k on before you spend a single penny or form a single opinion on your cars handling, my 320d with low miles on it (when still standard) actually had a nicer balance than any of my subsequent e46's, simply for the fact that the geometry and bushes were all spot on. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 In what context do you want to improve handling? Road or track? Because IMO, British roads are so poor, putting anything too low and too stiff is a no no. Also, low and stiff is not only uncomfortable, it's bad on poor surfaces, you'll be skipping and skitting all over the road. The point of suspension is to keep your tyres on the road at all times with the added bonus of keeping the car upright instead of tipping over. It's a very fine balance. I think the E46 handles very well for a very large and pretty heavy car. I would start by replacing all your bushes for brand new stiffer ones, polyurathene (sp) If that doesn't help then go for some springs and possibly thicker roll bars & strut braces. And always, always get your geometry set up properly as you're just throwing money down the drain if you dont. Regarding the wallowy nature, IMO the only real way to cure that is lose weight, you'll improve cornering massively with less weight but it's a compromise - you'll lose that premium-ness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 A good example of my slammed 320d leaning hard in KW V3's Fully powerflexed front to back as well Uprated bars would have finished that car well actually Damn I miss my orient blue lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) Strut braces were on my 320d as pictured front and rear, they won't make a whole lot of difference tbh but they do sharpen the chassis response just a little, they will of course work better in conjunction with all the above things mentioned. TBH I never short of very impressed with the std BMW Sport setup, it's an excellent balance / compromise once you put on the same size tyres all round, only on the provision those bushes, shocks and geometry are all c**k on, the only good reason I would remove a fresh std factory sport setup is to get lower ride height. Edited December 6, 2011 by Phantom Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny330i Posted December 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) Definatley road handling, just want to stiffen it up, not saying it handles badly currently, it just doesnt inspire confidence! Think my first step is going to be some poly bushes! I'm sure mine are knackered after 150,000miles! EDIT: car is already on equal width tyres all round, need to replace the linglongs with some contysport contacts or something though Edited December 6, 2011 by Johnny320d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Mark - I can't believe you'd do all that suspension work and then put tyres that dont fit on! I wont be trying it, but I reckon simply shedding about 400kg's of weight from an E46 would make it handle delightfully. How you'd do that I have no idea though lol. Interesting point you raise about staggered tyre sizes. IMO BMW put them on to stop people over steering through the nearest bush more than any other reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Definatley road handling, just want to stiffen it up, not saying it handles badly currently, it just doesnt inspire confidence! Think my first step is going to be some poly bushes! I'm sure mine are knackered after 150,000miles! If you're doing the work yourself this'll be the cheapest mod you can do really and if you did the suspension without these then you might be wasting your time any way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Mark - I can't believe you'd do all that suspension work and then put tyres that dont fit on! I wont be trying it, but I reckon simply shedding about 400kg's of weight from an E46 would make it handle delightfully. How you'd do that I have no idea though lol. Interesting point you raise about staggered tyre sizes. IMO BMW put them on to stop people over steering through the nearest bush more than any other reason. Lol, it's the tyres peeling off the rims mate, they were right size Tb fair the lips were quite pronounced on those rims And yes I agree, BMW definately want to give us sporty, but not too sporty, heck even std M3's understeer like a boat when pushed hard on track on the std kit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 If you're doing the work yourself this'll be the cheapest mod you can do really and if you did the suspension without these then you might be wasting your time any way. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny330i Posted December 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) Oh yes, will be doing all bits myself. Which bushes actually need changing? Obv the ARB bushes, lower arm bushes? rear subframe bushes? Bit of a n00b when it comes to what bushes go where etc. Seen some powerflex kits, what do they include? Edited December 6, 2011 by Johnny320d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autosri Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 The biggest improvement to handling I have made is adjustable camber plates and a custom alignment I have jom coils Polly bushed rtab and fcab I have the biggest arb on the rear that is oem which is from a 330 convertible and I have a decent strut bar on the front This is all on a clubsport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Having not done mine and seen just how many are available I'll let Mark do the talking on that. Thinking of doing mine next year though when the weather is nicer. Mark, if thats what correct fit tyres look like under cornering strains, imagine what stretched ones look like! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autosri Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Keep meaning to do my anti roll bar bushes with power flex but can't see them making much difference really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Mark Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 (edited) I'm not so sure they do either mate, but if your gonna go all in worth doing so you can tick it off the list eh, chances are they will be better than anything your replacing. Powerflex sell a full kit for the E46, about £235 iirc, but yes, basically all the bushes you mentioned and autoSri Adjustable camber plates well worth it if you plan to track it, adjustable rear camber arms a must regardless if you plan a big drop in height else you will destroy the rear tyres in less than 1k easy peasy. Edited December 6, 2011 by Phantom Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 In all my years I have only replaced 2 bushes, front ARB bushes on an MR2 where the ARB attached to the floorpan of the car. I fitted polly's and you really could see and feel the difference when you held them side by side. The added bonus of pollies is they will take a far bigger battering than rubber before splitting and, from what I gather, under normal conditions, just dont wear out like rubber does. Chances are, anything over 50-60k will have worn bushes that will continue to work but wouldnt hurt to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonlpearce Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 TBH i think Mark has hit the nail on the head. Stiffer ARB's, powerfelx all round and full alignment or geo. Then if your feeling you need more then look at some coilovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autosri Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Mine is quite low on the rear and still had enough adjustment on the rear I actually run less camber on the rear than standard When the weather warms up I will do the arb bushes but at the minute the Westfield kit car is taking all my time lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrimja Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Mine is quite low on the rear and still had enough adjustment on the rear I actually run less camber on the rear than standard When the weather warms up I will do the arb bushes but at the minute the Westfield kit car is taking all my time lol Woah! What kit car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autosri Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 It's a westfield wide body it's a lotus 7 type car built from a sierra 2l 8v but it's looking very sorry for itself at the minute lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blair Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Im pretty happy with the way mine handleson the road. Done: H&R front anti roll bar Front Strut brace Poly bushed EVERY possible bush HSD springs & shocks 20mm wheel spacers all round M3 convertable rear anti roll bar 2 deg Neg camber front 1.5 deg Neg camber rear Ride height the same all round 560mm 330cian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_330CI Posted December 6, 2011 Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 Blair - did you do the bushes yourself? Which ones are the easiest to fit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny330i Posted December 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2011 How did you fit the m3 rear arb? Thought they were a diff shape to the coupes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
